From hecate.umd.edu!haven.umd.edu!news.umbc.edu!europa.chnt.gtegsc.com!howland.reston.ans.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!meibm13.cen.uiuc.edu!vt6426 Fri Jun 30 18:48:12 1995 Path: hecate.umd.edu!haven.umd.edu!news.umbc.edu!europa.chnt.gtegsc.com!howland.reston.ans.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!meibm13.cen.uiuc.edu!vt6426 From: vt6426@meibm13.cen.uiuc.edu (Vichitra Tyagi) Newsgroups: alt.music.primus Subject: how the hell does Herb do that? Date: 30 Jun 1995 16:37:44 GMT Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana Lines: 40 Message-ID: <3t198o$b37@vixen.cso.uiuc.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: meibm13.cen.uiuc.edu Status: RO I didn't think Herb would top his performance on Frizzle Fry. Especially after hearing Pork Soda and Tales. Not that they are bad albums, but the drumming is not what it is on Frizzle Fry. Good drumming or bad drumming (some people are not impressed with his stuff after FF, but that's aside the point), Herb always goes pushes himself for the "most musical solution" as he says in the Tama Starclassic drum advertisement in one of the recent Modern Drummer magazines (the one with Herlin Riley on the cover, Wynton Marsalis' drummer.) So, in that sense, Herb may not technically shine in PS or Tales (well, even that is subjective, because some of the shit he does really rips and is difficult) as he did in the previous albums, but I do sense what he plays is the most musical solution, chops or no chops because it is the best drum part that would fit at the instant, nothing really could be better. Not that that he "writes" his parts out, but he doesn't rip unnecessarily, showing his maturity. (I mean we all know he can do all that) But Laundry is something different. It's the "evil" side of Herb so to speak :) I am serious, this is some of the best rock drumming I have ever heard FROM ANYONE. Anyone find his drumming as amazing as I do? This is !^$%^#%^ incredible!!! Listen to the last 2 minutes or so of Stitch. It's in 7/4 with quarter note eqaul to about 140 or so BPM (haven't exactly measured that, but just estimating) and Herb plays double time improv like you wouldn't BELIEVE. Man, he does some Polyrhtyhm Bill Bruford stuff like in double time with syncopations on the offbeat and you think he gets off but it's all there!! there's something I figured out that no way in hell 99.9% of drummers out there could do: hh w/foot 1x..2x..3x..4x..5x..6x..7x.. snare 1.xx2.xx3.xx4.xx5.xx6.xx7.xx tom 1...2...3...4...5...6...7... bass drum x...x...x...x...x...x...x... splash cymbal x...x...x...x...x...x...x... doesn't look very hard, but at high speeds, it can be. herb just screws around with ghost notes, rolls, fast tom stuff, weird high hat Neil Peart type stuff. btw, who was the Modern Drummers' reader's poll resutl of the best progressive drummer? From vt6426@coewl.cen.uiuc.edu Thu Jun 29 16:44:09 1995 Received: from elan1.carb.nist.gov by ram.org via SMTP (920330.SGI/920502.SGI) for ram id AA07082; Thu, 29 Jun 95 16:44:09 -0400 Received: from meibm13.cen.uiuc.edu by elan1.carb.nist.gov via SMTP (931110.SGI/920502.SGI) for ram@ram.org id AA06657; Thu, 29 Jun 95 16:49:33 -0400 Received: by meibm13.cen.uiuc.edu id AA15074 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ram@elan1.carb.nist.gov); Thu, 29 Jun 1995 15:44:46 -0500 Date: Thu, 29 Jun 1995 15:44:46 -0500 From: Vichitra Tyagi Message-Id: <199506292044.AA15074@meibm13.cen.uiuc.edu> To: ram@elan1 Subject: Re: in depth analysis of herb alexander... Newsgroups: alt.music.primus References: <3ssd6v$f01@vixen.cso.uiuc.edu> <3st3e6$oga@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <3sua4m$bb5@hecate.umd.edu> Status: RO hey, glad you agree with me about Herb and his drumming. I mean, people have to realize that Neil Peart is excellent and a very fine drummer/lyricist but he's not as good as people think he is. That is not taking anything away from him but just giving more to Herb on my part. I just think Herb would blow Neil away if you had them trade licks on drumsets. I mean, Have you heard the Launddry album yet?? Man, that is a mediocre band who isn't that great but Herb just puts them on a whole new level just because of his awesome ass drumming. Same for tool, those guys aren't really that good (guitarists) but Danny Carey does the same for them the way Herb does for Laundry. I mean, I even find Danny Carey of Tool more inspiring and more enjoyable to listen to than Peart (call it better). All the shit on Laundry is amazing, I mean the improv the feel and just keep time while keeping it entertaining, yet it is so difficult that 99% of drummers in general can't do that. I mean, it's got it all the double bass, fast hands, fast feet, the improvisation, the creativity. somethings which what most other drummers specialize in such as Peart in doing fast fills, etc who doesn't really have a feel Brudford, the polyrhtyhmic stuff but no double bass stuff and the odd meters. Herb just has it all...and he can do jazz too. just imagine if he wrote all his drum parts out and decided to play the same parts (he'd probably make them pretty hard) concert after concert. He'd probably get a bigger name, but you see, he can do all that shit without writing his parts out (as Neil does.) I think you understand what I'm trying to say about Herb, but it's pretty frustrating to explain that to Rush fans (not that I don't like Rush fans) who don't even play drums and consider Peart the best ever. Go read a.m.r and see what I'm mean. You say anyything about Peart not being the best or any constructive criticism you get flamed.. also, man, even MIKE portno (dream theater) blows peart away but he's one of those guys who writes his parts out (still harder than peart's)..but i'm sure he can do Herb type feel/improv stuff since he studied at a jazz school and decided to play metal because that's what he really wnated to do and that's where the money is at. It would make no sense for him to play jazz when he wouldn't the money he ism kaing now.. anyway, mail m e here and tell me what you think.. btw, have you ehard herb on Michael Manring's THONK album? simply amazing hardest groove stuff I've heard in awhile.. btw, great job on the cheezy homepage... Vic From c45man@ix.netcom.com Tue Jul 30 16:55:15 1996 Received: from aries.ai.net ([208.194.41.4]) by ram.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA02254 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 1996 16:55:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.6]) by aries.ai.net (8.6.11/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA13909 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 1996 16:56:17 -0400 Received: from (c45man@vfg-pa2-19.ix.netcom.com [205.184.1.83]) by dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com (8.6.13/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA16140 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 1996 13:55:20 -0700 Date: Tue, 30 Jul 1996 13:55:20 -0700 Message-Id: <199607302055.NAA16140@dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com> From: c45man@ix.netcom.com (Frank P Gagliardi) Subject: someone was wrong To: me@ram.org.whoever.answered.the.question.about.how.les.claypool.started Status: RO playing bass is wrong. He said that his school needed an upright bass player. But what really happened was that there was a guitarist in his school that started a band called Blind Illusion (which is still around today with the same guitarist but he has had many different people)but what happened was that they didn't have a bass player and les had always wanted to play an instrument and he had a friend who was selling a bass and a friend who was selling a snare drum. So if he bought the drum he wouldn't have been able to be in the band so he thought about the bass and decided to buy it but his dad knew someone who worked at a music store and got him a bass for a good deal. And he joined Blind Illusion with out an amp and just got to know the feel of playing it and then quit that band a while later and joined another band called the Tommy Crank band. He quit that band and went back to B.I. and quit again and started primate with jay lane and Todd Huth and changed the name to Primus because there was a band called the primates and their lawer got on their caseand made them change it but then jay lane went back to his old band and les got ler and herb and a month after alot of jamming they recorded "suck on this". if you have any questions e-mail me, Brian Gagliardi